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attempting wood/canvas rebuild

Discussion in 'Wood and Canvas' started by anthony, Mar 8, 2005.

  1. anthony

    anthony Arrowslinger

    Hi All !!! This is my first post so I'll start with INTENT which is to INDENTIFY the MAKER and MODEL,REPAIR,and PUT INTO USE an old wood and canvas CANOE. I had viewed MARTIN DUMAS' post(02/18/05) and found feedback to be great! My canoe is somewhat similar to his.I will need to replace a few Ribs and a wee bit of planking but nothing I can't handle!?!CANOE has no canvas.OUTERGUNS and KEEL are removed.CANOE has 56 RIBS. single center THWART located between 27/28th RIB from STERN(THWART has only 1 bolt per side). SEATS Stern only...Bow m.i.a. Are the same as MARIN'S but only 6 top slats.Bracing under slats appear to be made of Rib(for inner 2)and ?(for outer 2) . MOUNTED 35 and 44" from STERN(from tip where INNERGUNS meet) with3/4"x3/4" round dowel spacers. I have strung a taughtline from the outermost tips of my INNERGUNS (186") and will include measurement to this as STRINGLINE (might help establish rocker?). O.K. If your still with me,I'll get down to MEASUREMENTS(and brief description):::LENGHT=15'10" (15'6" Stringline[as mentioned earlier]). WIDTH MID=34 1/2"(no OUTGUNS). DEPTH MID=13" (19" toStringline). DEPTH END (not sure how to Measure so I took Measure from interior where Stem notches for first Rib).:15" to DECKTOP (19" to Stringline).CANOE RIBS 5/16"x1 1/2" rounded both edges:3"on center with cupwasher and screw to keel every 4th Rib. PLANKING 5/32"x3 5/8" Red???Cedar...Brass tacked(4per). DECKS look much like MARTIN'S.simple rad. and bevel at handhold/single eyebolt-bow only.There were NO IDENTIFYING MARKINGS ON EITHER DECK...(NO IDENTIFYING MARKS anywhere on this CANOE...not anywhere!?! I find that odd!!! I T.M.[my name is tony may hence T.M.]anyways,I T.M. everything I build...so to me,NO MARKS is odd!). INNERGUNS Spruce 3/4"x1". OUTERGUNS 7/16"(top edge)x1 1/8" Hardwood(not exactly sure what type).OUTERGUNS are 2 PC. They are both spliced at 50" from one end.As is the KEEL. Did someone tightfist the moneyroll for materials??? Poor quality? Limited materials? What's up? Any ideas on"Splice"??? KEEL(2 pc. spliced) 1/2"x1" fairly squared.(shoe?). CANOE had Brass STEM BANDS but must have new.STEMS are notched to 8th RIB.That's all I can give for now.PLEASE HELP WITH INFO AND SUGGESTIONS as I can only sit my butt in my (whoops) aluminum for 1 more season !!! My parents had started stripping this CANOE and truth be told...I don't care how long it takes.This CANOE will float once more!!! THANKS TO ALL ! n.b.:Will check responses in this forum or anthonydmay@hotmail.com
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2005
  2. Paul Scheuer

    Paul Scheuer LOVES Wooden Canoes

    A picture would certainly help. I may have missed it, but did you say anything about the planking ?
     
  3. OP
    OP
    anthony

    anthony Arrowslinger

    Hey Paul. No pics. at this time. maybe in a fortnight. Planking appears to be Red cedar 5/64"x3 5/8" .T.M.
     
  4. Dave Wermuth

    Dave Wermuth Who hid my paddle?

    Hmm, if 8 64ths = one eighth inch. then four 64ths would be one half of one eigth (1/16") and 5/64 would be just barely over one half of one eigth. And a lightweight canoe is 1/8" plank and 1/4" rib, then this would be a really lightweight canoe? Or do you mean 5/32" which is just over-------- te-he. cabin fever. Cheers, Dave.
     
  5. OP
    OP
    anthony

    anthony Arrowslinger

    32nd?64th?? There sort of the same aren't they? (that's what happens after 20 yrs. as a steelworker!!!) Yes Dave...5/32nds. thanks T.M.
     
  6. OP
    OP
    anthony

    anthony Arrowslinger

    Not "somewhat similar" ,They could be brothers! I see the pics. were posted from 2 hours down the road from me here in FRIENDLY MANITOBA ...CANADA.But my measurments stand at 16' lenght/ 13" depth mid/ 19 ? end (I believe I measured this properly).And what say you of the spliced outers and keel?
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2005
  7. Dan Miller

    Dan Miller cranky canoeist Staff Member

    Could be a Chestnut Deer model - adding in a couple inches to account for the tumblehome, the measurements would be about right (you did say you measured the beam over the rails, excluding the gunwales). (Could also be Peterborough's or Canadian's version of the same model - pics would help here...or look for the shadow of the deck decal).

    Chestnut commonly scarfed gunwales. I would expect the same to be true for keels, though I haven't run into one personally...
     
  8. Douglas Ingram

    Douglas Ingram Red River Canoe & Paddle

    Anthony,

    Where are you? If Oakbank is just 2 hours down the road from you, I might be able to help out. Check your map for Lorette.
     
  9. OP
    OP
    anthony

    anthony Arrowslinger

    I'm a wheat city import.Been here 25 yrs.I see your'e just south of Scott.Do you know him?(logs in as cbntmkr [cabinetmaker?] out of Oakbank. (I'm assuming Scott is a he even though pics. in his photo/rebuild canoe album shows a woman doing the (ugh!!!) stripping of old glass! (Har...Har...).I have just now recovered a serial # from the stern stem. Stamped Top of Wide end. It was quite difficult to find as my folks had stripped and sanded. 5 digit #23135. Manitoba Rocks! thanks Douglas.
     
  10. OP
    OP
    anthony

    anthony Arrowslinger

    Hello my Deer!!! (I am an avid arrowslinger who hunts with a BUCK brand bow so the DEER seems like a match for me!)I knew this canoe didn't have Prospector rocker and would like to thank all the members who helped in the IDENTIFY MAKER AND MODEL part of my quest! Dan's wood canoe identification guide(likely familiar to most)http://www.dragonflycanoe.com/id/ Was helpful and very interesting.(I have it saved as a favorite for quick reference). Great Guide ! I began with the REPAIR part last night. Removing iron tacks from previous "repairs" Some of the heads had rusted off but were easily identified by the telltale damage they do.I did however find a few more by "floating" a good magnet over anything odd looking and found this to work well ! The 16' DEER is indeed single iron tacked at the Rib/Inwale joint. Thanks to ALL!!! T.M.
     
  11. OP
    OP
    anthony

    anthony Arrowslinger

    Good morning All ! Having coffee with my Deer and pondering my seat situation...or should I say lack of...(bow missing/stern damaged).I'm all for original.My '70 NOVA is all original but I have a few ideas for this CANOE and hope I don't get labeled as one of those "savage wood butchers"! I want to make a sail (planning NEXT winters project already???) and the bow seat with mast ring(Ferwerda or similar plans) seems like a mighty fine idea to me.Any input on placement? As for stern, I am contemplating a SADDLE seat.I'm fairly sure I would need additional thwart near stern but I have no problem with that.It would appear to me that with enough strap length and gunwale stability,a fellow could adjust for trim.Is this the case? Also,does the Saddle style negatively affect transferance of momentum at all? Any opinions on appearance with regards to 1 stationary wood and 1 leather saddle? Could a Sadddle style be used as a temp. seat for a small person elsewhere in a canoe??? One more thing...I'm looking for repair materials...Rib and Plank for now...Any good "North of the Border "suppliers?(maybe Doug can help me here?) That's all for now... T.M.
     
  12. Woodchuck

    Woodchuck Woodworker

  13. Douglas Ingram

    Douglas Ingram Red River Canoe & Paddle

    Yeah, Tony, Maybe Doug CAN help you. And I'm close, too.
     
  14. OP
    OP
    anthony

    anthony Arrowslinger

    sorry,you were the Doug i meant. You prefer Douglas?
     
  15. Douglas Ingram

    Douglas Ingram Red River Canoe & Paddle

    Doug, Douglas, Hey you! Mr. Ingram... whatever.

    Depends upon how old you are...

    Give me a call, I'll do what I can. If my number isn't in the profile, then I'm in the phone book.
     
  16. OP
    OP
    anthony

    anthony Arrowslinger

    I'm looking at the Rib/Inwale area of my Deer and I don't think the single iron tack is going to cut it.Most of them are loose enough that I had no trouble sliding my "scraping tool" between them. Heads are starting to rust.I'm replacing some Ribs and Planking anyways,so I thought maybe remove the single iron,clean up the area and fill(I've seen this question before but what IS the best thing to use for white cedar rib filler?)and refasten using 2 brass.Hmm???...Why would my "peter-nut" be brass tacked for the planking then iron tacked at the Rib/Inwale(and only one)? I've heard about declining quality. I'm doing extensive repairs/customizing to this Canoe and as the iron tacks are either rusting or beginning to pull through the ribs they GOTTA GO!!! That's just my muleheaded opinion though. Any others??? (opinions,not muleheaded people). Happy day! T.M.
     
  17. OP
    OP
    anthony

    anthony Arrowslinger

    CANT RIBS: My cants are made of planking material.I am working on both stems and am thinking of replacing with rib materials.(one of four is missing,another damaged).Should I shape 4 new from rib materials or replace as per original? would new cants strengthen enough to justify changing? thanks all! T.M.
     

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